Kurdwin Ayub Locarno Film Festival 2024 Interview: “Mond”, “Moon”

Writer and director Kurdwin Ayub was born in Iraq, but her family came to Austria as refugees when she was still a child. Now 34, she is making a name for herself in the film world as an author.

Her 2016 feature-length documentary film Paradise! Paradise!, which she wrote, directed and shot, won the Best Camera Award at the Diagonale – Austrian Film Festival. It tells the story of Omar, a father of a family who has lived in Austria since 1991. Now he plans to buy an apartment in Kurdistan as an investment. THRThe review called the documentary “an engaging mix of domestic and geopolitical issues.”

Her short fiction film Boomerang premiered at the Filmfestival Max Ophüls Preis in Saarbrücken, Germany, in 2019 and won the Jury Prize for Best Short Film. “Adnan is obsessed with the idea of ​​going to his ex-wife’s housewarming party,” explains the plot description. “Unfortunately, he’s not invited.”

Ayub’s feature film debut Sunny (Sunny) had its world premiere at the 2022 Berlin Film Festival in the Encounters section, which aims to “support aesthetically and structurally more daring works by independent, innovative filmmakers.” The film centers on three friends who decide to make a music video for a burqa “in a moment of pure madness.” Ayub ultimately won the award for best first feature, given across all the festival’s sections.

On Sunday, her second feature film Monday (Moon) will make its long-awaited debut in international competition at the 77th Locarno Film Festival. Like her first feature film, it was produced by Ulrich Seidl Filmproduktion, with Austrian directors Ulrich Seidel and Veronika Franz serving as producers and associate producers, respectively, and other members of the team.

“Former martial arts champion Sarah leaves Austria to train three sisters from a wealthy Jordanian family,” reads the plot description on Locarno’s website. “What initially sounds like a dream job soon turns disturbing: the young women are cut off from the outside world and under constant surveillance. The sport clearly doesn’t interest them. So why was Sarah hired?”

In a director’s note on the website, Aybu explains, “It’s all about the sisters, no matter where they come from, and the cages, no matter where they are. The cages you want to leave and the ones you want to return to.”

Ayub spoke with THR about her new film, the meaning of music, why she likes to provoke audiences and what she plans for the future.

How exciting is it for you to bring Monday for a prestigious festival like Locarno?

Honestly, there is some pressure. Last week I thought that Sunny was so successful that I suddenly realized that it wasn’t normal to get this big first film award at the Berlinale. When I realized that, I thought, “Oh my God, Moon must also succeed.” But I have to deal with this kind of pressure. And I would like to be able to say one day, maybe in a year, Moon it was good and everything went perfectly.

People often say that second parts are hard, right?

It’s like a horror movie. Everyone says the second one is the hardest because then you have to prove if you’re really a filmmaker. With your first film, maybe you were lucky or something. At film festivals, they look for newcomers and want to discover someone, but with your second film they look and think twice.

Tell me a little about where you did it Monday and how you cast the film.

We shot mostly in Jordan. The casting process was very difficult because we went there and wanted to cast different young women and girls. And every time we told them we wanted them for the film, they ignored us. That happened a lot. So I found out that they only came to the castings and didn’t tell their parents. When we chose them, they started talking to their parents to ask if they could be in the film, but their parents said no.

Is it because of this particular movie or movies in general?

No, it’s any movie. Acting for girls is not considered an honorable job for some.

So how did you go about finding great cast members?

I found them there. Andria Tayeh is a very famous Netflix star in Jordan. She was the main character AlRawabi Girls School. She’s also a very influential person. So when I go out with her, everyone recognizes her. So when we got her, everyone wanted to be a part of it.

How did you cast Florentina Holzinger? I know she is well-known in the Austrian dance and performance scene, and you are active in the wider cultural sphere. Did you know each other before?

Yes, she’s also from Austria and I knew she did martial arts before. So when I was writing the story, I knew from the beginning that she would be the main character.

I thought she brought a lot of depth to the character of Sarah…

Yes, she is very good. In every shot she was very natural and great.

Why did you choose Jordan? Were there any real stories that happened there or in the wider region that you wanted to reference?

There are also stories in Jordan. I think the most famous story is about the king’s sister, who is Jordanian and she married the ruler of Dubai and went to England. But there are a lot of stories and it is very common to hire personal trainers if you are a wealthy family. We had a makeup artist on our team who also spent a year in the Gulf. I also wanted to have a country that is really liberal on the outside and also wealthy but still has these problems.

I’ve seen some of your dialogue spark debate. Some of the things that people, like Sarah’s friends, say in the film aren’t politically correct. How important is it to you that there’s that kind of bite in your dialogue?

Yes, I wanted to show a white chick walking there and I needed a realistic approach. It has to go through your body so you feel it. What they say is what I told them to say, but how they say it and everything is theirs. So it’s also improvisation, but I guide them and tell them, “You have to be more incorrect.” I mean, I tell them what I want from the scene and how it ends and I guide them. But the most important part is the casting process. When I cast people, I do different scenes and I try everything to make sure that they are not only natural but also intelligent and creative.

Of course you know the culture you’re writing about really well. How much of your own experience do you pack into your films?

I think that some parts of the characters and the movies are somehow me because I wrote them. What Sarah, the character in Austria, sometimes feels, I also feel. And what the girls in Jordan felt in this particular family, I also feel sometimes. The sisters in this family and their characters are inspired by my cousins.

When did you move to Austria and how often did you visit your family in Iraq?

I came as a child, but I went to Iraq a lot. Sometimes I feel like an alien, like the character Sarah, when I go to Iraq. So I’m in the middle of these cultures. I have both and I have neither. I don’t think about identities, borders or countries anymore.

What was your thought process behind the ending of the film? How did you decide whether to have a clear ending or an open ending? (The next answer contains spoilers about the ending.)

I wanted to leave it that way because in reality it would be like this. If you only have a glimpse of what you see or think you see, and you never really know. I wanted to show that. And Sarah is the perfect person to identify with my culturally white audience. I know that a lot of privileged white people go to my arthouse films, so I thought I needed Sarah to lead them. And I wanted to have a white savior story, but tell it in a very realistic way to say to the audience, “It’s not easy to help — do you still like it?”

Kurdwin Ayub

Also on the other side of this cliché and stereotype are refugees who come here and think there is help. That was my main goal: to tell a story to show this stereotype and show both sides. It’s not like in the movies.

So the topics you wanted to explore in Monday If…

Like I said, it’s about a realistic take on the white savior. And it’s about violence, and it’s also about cages. Sarah is a cage fighter. And the girls are in a cage of wealth.

I would like to ask you how you choose music. Because music plays a key role in Monday also…

Music is always very important to me. And especially in this film, every piece of music in every scene I chose for that scene. Music should give the scene a special feeling that fits what is happening. The last song is S&M Rihanna. I think I chose that song because Sarah chose violence for her work, but in reality she avoids it. So I wanted to show different types of violence and how the characters fight it and are for it or against it.

You did it Sunny (Sunny) and Monday (Moon). Should we expect a trilogy ending Star (Stars) or what are you planning next?

I have a story. I’m writing it. Hopefully we’ll shoot it again in Jordan, maybe in 2026. And I don’t know, maybe it’s about the whole planetary system. I don’t want to end it. I thought it shouldn’t end. Stars. Maybe it’s more. Maybe it’s Mars.

Can you tell us something about the next story?

Likewise. It’s the escape part, but with a different constellation.

Your cinematic voice is quite sarcastic and provocative. Where does that come from?

I’ve become very cynical in my life. I think movies have become very nice lately in general. They try to be nice to everyone. And I don’t like that.

I want to trigger people. Because everyone is afraid to trigger. But I’ve had a lot of therapy in my life and I’ve found that you have to know why something triggers you. And you have to think about it, and you have to go through it, and you have to learn. And if you watch art or movies or read books, you feel after the experience, you see yourself and you think about yourself. That’s wonderful.

I want people to argue with each other, discuss and think about how they would react in such situations after watching the film, because it’s an important topic. It’s not a love story or a comedy. There are big things happening there, so the film should live up to those expectations.

And I have a very dark sense of humor. I also like horror movies. I was a kid when we were escaping Iraq during the Gulf War. But I think when you go through war or the trauma of war, you have this kind of very cynical humor.

Your films feature strong female perspectives. Do you consider yourself a feminist?

I think every woman is a feminist, right? I don’t know. I think of myself as an artist first, but directing and writing about these topics comes very naturally to me because I also fought for my rights in my family. It’s important to see this film, for everyone, and also for my family.

Is there anything else you would like to emphasize?

I want to emphasize that these characters in the film are unique and of course I show specific issues. But ultimately you can deal with sexism or being in a cage wherever you live. Whether it’s Baghdad, Amman, Vienna or any other city. It doesn’t matter where you live or where you come from. But the film is set there because I also want to provoke people and show something that gives people something to talk about.